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I worship at the television altar
Smallville 9x16 - Escape
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From: (Anonymous) Date: April 12th, 2010 03:32 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: New Poster. :)

Hi:) Thanks for the reply. Great to hear from you. I post quite a bit over on the ShoE homepage as MJ and I also post on DI and Superverses. I do appreciate your reviews because I honestly feel like you give all the characters a chance and you try to stay objective and give all the characters the benefit of the doubt. I admit up front that I'm a huge fan of the Clark/Lois relationship BUT I consider myself a Clark Kent fan first and foremost. I want every plotline on this show to revolve around him and not the other way around. I always try to look at this show through Clark's perspective. Clois tends to make Clark look really good so I find it's easy to support that relationship. I also find that in Lois-centric episodes, Clark is ALWAYS at the center. I always approach an episode wanting to see Clark succeed, be validated when he's right and be HAPPY. I personally hate the term "shipper" because I think it misrepresents why so many of us support relationships like Clark and Lois. We actually talk about this all the time over on Superverses. We don't consider ourselves shippers. We are mythos fans and fans of Clark Kent and Superman first. We love the characters as individuals first and together second. We support the relationship that seems to have made him the most happy but we are just as happy (if not happier) to see Clark's role as both a hero and journalist explored.

I don't think you were being over critical about the relationship. It's just a general observation i've noticed throughout the fandom. It just seems like no matter what the writers do with Clark and Lois---someone will complain. Either they're moving too fast or moving too slow. Last year, there were fans complaining that their connection seemed only based on lust now there are fans complaining that they need more sex. Some fans complain that they want to see less banter and more serious conversations while others complain if the show dials down the banter for more sincere conversations. It's enough to make your head spin. I just think the pressure and expectations for this particular relationship are light years more than the average Tv relationship. I totally agree that the writers have made some mistakes every now and then. I am of the opinion right now that the writers and showrunners almost slowed Clois down TOO much over the course of the last few episodes. I just think they are so nervous about keeping it slow that they almost "over managed" them.

It's funny because Mairzee Almas had an interesting comment when she was on ShoE for the "Disciple" podcast. Personally, I thought that the opening scene of "Disciple" might have been the hottest scene between those two in the second half of the season next to the scene in Conspiracy. Mairzee was talking about how much Tom and Erica liked each other personally and how much they enjoyed working together. Steve asked her how she would manage them in a scene like that---how much direction she would give them. She said that she already felt like Tom and Erica KNEW what to bring to the table for Clark and Lois and that she tried to limit her role with them to just reminding them of what was coming in the episode, where they were in the script and maybe encourage their reactions. But she indicated that with the two of them it was sort of af "less is more" on the part of the director because they know what to do together. Just step back and let their "natural charimsa" together play out. It's just funny because there have been times over the course of the second half of the season where I've almost felt like Clark and Lois were being over-directed. Like the script and the director were just too invested in getting something right or keeping something slow that they interfered with the natural charisma that exists between these two. My personal opinion is that with Tom and Erica every director needs to follow Mairzee's advice. Less is more. Just let them go and they will figure out what needs to be done with these characters. The writers should just tell the story that they want to tell and stop allowing other people to influence how they write their story. That goes for EVERYTHING on this show.
Anyway, great chatting with you.

tariel22 From: tariel22 Date: April 13th, 2010 03:53 am (UTC) (Link)

Re: New Poster. :)

Oh, MJ! I totally know who you are! I agree with you A LOT! Especially about Chloe. :) Thanks again for your very kind words. I have to admit I couldn't take the criticism when my reviews were posted on the SHoE site. My viewpoint didn't seem to mesh well with the SHoEligans. ;) I'm much happier in my little LJ world.

Obviously there are all kinds of fans of the Clois relationship, and I can understand not caring for the shipper label, and all the preconceived notions that come with it. My own personal idea of a shipper is someone whose enjoyment of the show hinges on what's going on with their couple, and who puts the development of the romance above any other element of the story. I know a lot of the people on my flist who identify themselves as Clois shippers are big Lois fans. Some of them didn't even watch Checkmate because Lois wasn't in it.

I think the writers have had a hard time with Clark and Lois as a couple because of the uncertainty of renewal with this show. They know what they want the end game to be, and when they thought S8 might be the last, they accelerated a lot of things, like Clark's career at the DP and his relationship with Lois, and I thought the first 10 episodes of that season were the best I had ever seen on this show. Strong, proactive Clark, lots of funny, flirty banter, and a real shift in the focus of the story to Metropolis, journalism, and Clark embracing his destiny. What wasn't to love? And then Tom signed on for two more years, the momentum of the season was derailed by Lana's return, and the show had to slam on the brakes as they contemplated their long-term plans. In many ways I love this season even more, but I think we're seeing some of the same timing hiccups.

I remember well what Mairzee Almas said in that Disciple podcast, and I appreciate that her style has always been to sort of stand back and let the actors do their thing, stepping in with direction when it's needed, but trusting in them to know their characters. I loved the scenes between Clark and Lois in Disciple! The chemistry was off the charts! It's funny, I totally read Clark's invitation to Lois to come back to the farm as a sexual one, but so many people told me that I was dead wrong, I started to second guess myself. But now, after Escape, I think more than ever that I was right. How Lois was strong enough to turn him down, I'll never know! :D

I'm so glad you decide to comment here. I've really enjoyed discussing the show with you!
From: (Anonymous) Date: April 13th, 2010 06:53 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: New Poster. :)

I wondered why I wasn't seeing you on SHoE this year! I totally understand though. Honestly, I think sometimes people just need to understand that there are many different kinds of fans of this show and that many different perspectives are valid. The biggest problem in Smallville fandom is that many people assume that the reason that THEY watch the show is more important (or better) than the reason that others do. People who watch only for the relationships fail to recognize that many fans out there just aren't as interested as they are and that the relationships can only be PART of the story but can't be the whole story. But on the other side of the coin, fans who watch soley for the action or watch only to see Clark fight villians aren't really being fair when they label the lighter episodes as being a waste of time or "shipperfests." In my opinion, if a scene adds anything to Clark's growth or character then it's worthwhile. But at the end of the day, it's just weird to me that so many people out there assume that their view on the show just HAS to be the right one. All opinions are valid so long as they are presented in a constructive and reasonable manner. (Which obviously excludes senseless bashing or distorting the actual show canon to suit your own agenda---which as you well know, many fans do.) That's actually my biggest pet peeve--when any fan or reviewer makes a general statement without backing it up with the actual show canon or twisting the accuracy of the canon.

You weren't the only one who read the scene in Disciple as sexual. I did too and I don't think you were dead wrong. I don't think he was asking for sex per se. (That would have been a little fast for Clark.) I just kind of thought he was hoping to make out and maybe get to second base or something. LOL. Basically I thought that "I could show you Clark KEnt's tour of the galaxy" was his way of saying, "Come back to the farm and let me feel you up for a little while." LOL. And then he kissed her mid-sentence after that as if to make his point. So don't second guess yourself. I think you were right. He's Clark. It's not like he would have pressured her or anything if she wasn't ready which was why he didn't push it after she said no.

As for the shipper thing...yeah, I don't get that. I'm a fan of Smallville. I love Lois. She is my second favorite person on the show AFTER Clark. But at the end of the day this is Clark's show. Lois is the second most important person in the Superman story....but it's HIS story. I would never miss an episode as long as it had CLARK in it. Most of the Clois fans I know and associate with on the web would never not watch an episode because of lack of Lois. They love Clark too much.

I am interested in hearing your thoughts on Checkmate. My initial reaction to the episode was pretty close to rage due to Clark's low screentime and a few other things that upset me about his scenes in general. But the more I reflected on it the more my opinion changed completely. Now, I feel like I have a totally different opinion on everything Clark related from the episode and I can appreciate the episode in a whole new way.

Great chatting with you. Hope to talk to you again soon. :)


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